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Opening My Vistas

johnbaxterlists (apparently) - 09:48pm Mar 6, 2007 PST
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Glenn F writes, in Opening My VIstas (currently in ExtraBits)

> I just bought a new laptop with Windows Vista pre-installed, and,
> hey, I kinda like it.

Ok, Glenn, which of the following did we just "prove"--
   1. Great minds run in the same channels
   2. Fools think alike
(and no, I don't advocate setting up a TidBITS poll, as I doubt we
would like the results).

Sitting off to my right is a new laptop, much lower-end than yours
(although it does possess an Express 3/4 slot), and slightly over
half the price of yours. Sony N220. (I started at Dell's site,
which twice drove me away in confusion--surely they can do better.)
I wound up making what is likely my last CompUSA purchase (not out of
dislike, but out of impending closing--I dealt with a really nice
white-shirted guy on the floor there). That was on Sunday afternoon.

So far, the first hundred days Mac upstairs hasn't come crashing
through the ceiling in martial arts attack mode.

I also find Vista not to be heavily disliked. And the interface
folks hit a home run with the Office 2007 UI (home/student edition is
on the machine in 60-day trial mode thanks to Sony, and I've used and
continue to use the with-everything beta with XP under Parallels). I
should have a chance at Office at a spectacular price at an upcoming
computer club meeting.

My main annoyance so far with the security thing is that each time I
power up in a different location, I have to use the admin password to
tell Vista that it's OK to switch wireless settings (I don't have to
provide any information, just approve the switch). (WPA2 here, open
network at the local computer club, and a different WPA2 network at
the office which I may well set up in a few minutes when I go up to
town for dinner.) Getting the wireless to work with my LinkSys
WRT54GL was simpler than trivial (and simpler than under Tiger).

As with Glenn, the Macs remain my main machines, although at present
the Macbook is "resting."

   --John

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kevinv (apparently) - Mar 9, 2007 9:18 am (#1 Total: 7)

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Posts: 1350

Re: Opening My Vistas

I recently had to do tech support (remotely) with someone using Vista. It
was pretty frustrating.

I was using a remote control product call Inquerio (I think it's been
renamed to NTRSupport) that my company uses to provide remote support.
<http://www.ntrglobal.com/WEB/home.asp>

I ran into 2 problems that made the experience frustrating. One - none of
the security dialogs were visible remotely through the remote connection. I
can't figure out if this was intentional or if the OS is writing security
warnings directly to the video card, bypassing the system the remote
control software used, in order to create their neat effects.

The second issue is that once a security warning popped up, I lost control
of the remote computer. Until the program I opened that caused the security
prompt (regedit in one case) was closed I had to pass all my instructions
to the user and have her do them.

Both of these issues may have been caused by Inquerio not being updated for
Vista, but from talking to a couple of developers that are upgrading for
Vista support, it breaks a lot of applications. So if you use more than
just Office I'd probably be wary.

In fact my recommendation would be to NOT purchase a Vista upgrade, but
rather wait until you decide you need a new machine and get Vista then.

Even then the problem I was troubleshooting was on a brand new machine.
She had an issue with Remote Desktop Client on her new Sony Vaio and either
Sony, or the product she used requiring RDC, installed a RDC add-in that is
not Vista compliant. It prevented all connections with RDC. It took me 3
hours of alternating me controlling Vista until a security dialog
popped-up, then her controlling Vista, to figure out the problem.

johnbaxterlists (apparently) - Mar 10, 2007 12:02 pm (#2 Total: 7)

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Posts: 613

Re: Opening My Vistas

On Mar 9, 2007, at 8:18 AM, Kevin van Haaren wrote:

> In fact my recommendation would be to NOT purchase a Vista upgrade,
> but
> rather wait until you decide you need a new machine and get Vista
> then.

Both authors of "Windows Vista Secrets" say much the same thing.
Soon, I will be trying a Java-based monitoring and control system for
our Firewall, on my new laptop under Vista. We'll see (it installs
its own private Java, which either makes it more or less likely to
work--or both). (It runs fine on XP under Parallels.)

--John

johnbaxterlists (apparently) - Mar 12, 2007 12:15 pm (#3 Total: 7)

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Posts: 613

Re: Opening My Vistas

On Mar 10, 2007, at 11:02 AM, johnbaxterlists

mac.com wrote:

> Both authors of "Windows Vista Secrets" say much the same thing.
> Soon, I will be trying a Java-based monitoring and control system for
> our Firewall, on my new laptop under Vista. We'll see (it installs
> its own private Java, which either makes it more or less likely to
> work--or both). (It runs fine on XP under Parallels.)

Just to follow up on that install, the Installer refused to attempt
to install--on Vista--the management client for the firewall.

My guess is that when we are able to install a newer version, the
Windows installer for the management client will have been upgraded
for Vista.

--John

kevinv (apparently) - Mar 14, 2007 11:28 am (#4 Total: 7)

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Posts: 1350

Re: Opening My Vistas

--On March 10, 2007 11:02:22 AM -0800 johnbaxterlists

mac.com wrote:

> Both authors of "Windows Vista Secrets" say much the same thing.
> Soon, I will be trying a Java-based monitoring and control system for
> our Firewall, on my new laptop under Vista. We'll see (it installs
> its own private Java, which either makes it more or less likely to
> work--or both). (It runs fine on XP under Parallels.)

Nothing to do with vista - but if it's java based shouldn't it run under
the Mac without virtualization? And doesn't the whole concept of a private
Java defeat the whole concept of write once, run anywhere that java tried
to start?

johnbaxterlists (apparently) - Mar 15, 2007 8:21 am (#5 Total: 7)

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Posts: 613

Re: Opening My Vistas

On Mar 14, 2007, at 11:28 AM, Kevin van Haaren wrote:

> --On March 10, 2007 11:02:22 AM -0800 johnbaxterlists

mac.com wrote:
>
>> Both authors of "Windows Vista Secrets" say much the same thing.
>> Soon, I will be trying a Java-based monitoring and control system for
>> our Firewall, on my new laptop under Vista. We'll see (it installs
>> its own private Java, which either makes it more or less likely to
>> work--or both). (It runs fine on XP under Parallels.)
>
> Nothing to do with vista - but if it's java based shouldn't it run
> under
> the Mac without virtualization? And doesn't the whole concept of a
> private
> Java defeat the whole concept of write once, run anywhere that java
> tried
> to start?

You might very well think that, but as for me, I couldn't possibly
comment.
(So sad to read of the passing of Ian Richardson).

Seriously, it doesn't seem to.

And write once, run anywhere was never real, IMHO.

There is a Linux version of the tool, but a shortage of Linux here
(on my desktop). And the tool is happier under Windows.

--John

Curtis Wilcox (apparently) - Mar 15, 2007 8:21 am (#6 Total: 7)

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Posts: 355

Re: Opening My Vistas

On Mar 14, 2007, at 2:28 PM, Kevin van Haaren wrote:

> --On March 10, 2007 11:02:22 AM -0800 johnbaxterlists

mac.com wrote:
>
>> Both authors of "Windows Vista Secrets" say much the same thing.
>> Soon, I will be trying a Java-based monitoring and control system for
>> our Firewall, on my new laptop under Vista. We'll see (it installs
>> its own private Java, which either makes it more or less likely to
>> work--or both). (It runs fine on XP under Parallels.)
>
> Nothing to do with vista - but if it's java based shouldn't it run
> under
> the Mac without virtualization? And doesn't the whole concept of a
> private
> Java defeat the whole concept of write once, run anywhere that java
> tried
> to start?

Welcome to the reality of Java app implementations, both the lack of
cross-OS compatibility and the use of separate Java installations. A
Registrar's office at the university where I work uses a system for
classroom schedules and other information that uses a Java client app
that only works on Windows and requires Java 1.3.

kevinv (apparently) - Mar 16, 2007 12:17 pm (#7 Total: 7)

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Posts: 1350

Re: Opening My Vistas

Quoting Curtis Wilcox <tidbits

cognize.org>:

> Welcome to the reality of Java app implementations, both the lack of
> cross-OS compatibility and the use of separate Java installations. A
> Registrar's office at the university where I work uses a system for
> classroom schedules and other information that uses a Java client app
> that only works on Windows and requires Java 1.3.

I hope they updated that sucker for new DST rules. Can't think of
anything worse than classroom schedules that need have correct times.

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